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  • MangyForestCat posted an update in the group Group logo of Intermediate Modeler – Modeling Competition 2017Intermediate Modeler – Modeling Competition 2017 4 years, 8 months ago

    @syd Why is there a “racial purity test” for this competition?

    I do not understand at all the decision made to have this mixed messaging of what kits we are and are not allowed to use and whether they came from HLJ.com or not.

    If your intention was to create a completely closed ecosystem where no kits, but those bought from HLJ.com, would be eligible then obviously it is within your rights to do so. In that case why even bother with the description in the Advanced Category that it can be “a kit completely scratch-built, even a creation all your own that has never been seen before.”

    You know that from a logical perspective that those two things are mutually exclusive and cannot be true at the same time.

    You cannot BOTH

    A) Have a kit that you bought from HLJ.com or has been available to purchase from HLJ.com

    AND

    B) Make “a kit completely scratch-built, even a creation all your own that has never been seen before.”

    Those two are completely and utterly incompatible with each other. If you completely scratch-build a kit then it has obviously never been available for sale at HLJ.com. On top of which how do you judge this nonsensical little gem “the main part of your entry [has to] be an item that is, or was at one point, available for sale on hlj.com”? A completely scratch built, one-of-a-kind model, made at home from personally molded plastic/resin/vinyl/carbon-fiber, isn’t a kit that was once available from HLJ. On top of that, since it won’t have a “main part” to claim is from your website, how would you even possibly begin to categorize whether it’s eligible to partcipate?

    Honestly, I’ve studied with friends that have done computer programming and friends that have gone to law school. From a purely logical standpoint. This is terrible logic programming and makes no sense whatsoever.

    I bet this all went down a little something like this.

    Your boss Scott and everyone involved had a big discussion and, after a long examination and debate over 2013/2014, you decided to go a different direction and be more closed off, stifling, and restrictive with this year’s rules. Seeing all of this attention drawn to scratch built kits and items you do not sell on HLJ.com, you all came to the conclusion was not good for your business. You decided to make it more promotional in nature so that people would be more interested in using materials, building, and buying from HLJ.

    I get that. I completely understand that you want to draw attention to your company and this is all just one big promotion scheme. I’m not against that.

    What I am against is unclear rules and stifling creativity.

    Why not just be extremely clear, unrelenting, and Draconian with the rules? Why not just outright and flat-out state that we had to buy and a use a kit directly from HLJ.com? Why keep the colorful language in the Advanced Category saying you can completely scratch build a kit, when obviously that would, by any measure of logic, go against the idea that it’s from HLJ.com, or has at one time been sold there? You want to have it both ways and honestly your rules are not even close to allowing that to be true.

    And finally, why not just be more honest and open about this with EVERYONE? Why not just flat out tell everyone the reasons why you have different rules this year? Why have all this colorful, meandering, fuzzy, language around what is an isn’t allowed?

    Just be honest. You examined the 2013/2014 competition. You realized people weren’t necessarily using HLJ kits and materials. You didn’t really appreciate the true scratch-built and models from companies you don’t sell from. You decided to do this competition and be more restrictive with the rules and regulations. You decided to stifle people’s choices and imaginations in order to promote your shop.

    I hold none of that against you. You are a business. However, as I already mentioned, what I do hold against you is this unclear and rather ridiculous stance you have taken. It’s obvious you just did a “Copy & Paste” of the old competition rules and category descriptions but you added in the “racial purity test” to make sure the kits come from HLJ. However you failed to notice that the rules from 2013/2014 do not mesh well with the ADDED “racial purity test” of 2017.

    Why not just extremely clear about this?

    * For reference to everyone this is the link to 2013/2014’s competition.
    http://hlj.com/Playing-With-Plamo-Modeling-Competition-2013#howto

    ** This is the link to 2017’s competition
    http://hlj.com/plamo-2017#howto

    • The contest is called Playing with PLAMO. Even with the statement “a creation all your own that has never been seen before,” it’s CLEAR that there must be a plamo at the core of a submission.

      As for requiring kits to be available at HLJ at any time, it’s a reasonable rule given the proliferation of KOs.

      • I’m sorry I’m having a hard time understanding why you are trying to explain what the name of the competition means. I know what the competition means. I do not know why you’re explaining TO ME what it means.

        I won 4th place runner-up in the 2013-2014 competition for a price of 8,000 yen. So explain to me why you think you know more than me?

        Here is the link to the timestamp where my kit was featured.

        In fact both the scratch-built car before mine AND my own submission itself would both be ineligible from competing this year because of the added rules.

        The rule requiring kits available from HLJ is a nonsensical rule put in place to promote HLJ.com and not made clear at all with the FAQ or the Advanced Category description. You have failed to see my point.

        • I have no idea why you’re calling it a “racial” purity test.
          What does race have to do with anything?

        • And just a word to the wise, you’re coming off as holier than thou saying things like “So explain to me why you think you know more than me?”

          • Richigo I have much respect for you and your work. Your submission to the 2013/2014 competition was amazing.

            I did not even submit my entry to the Advanced Category in 2014. I submitted my entry to the Intermediate Category because I saw models like yours and others in the Advanced Category and I did not believe I could hack it at that level.

            I was moved to the Advanced Category by @Syd and the other judges. I was extremely humbled and honored to be considered and pushed into the Advanced Category.

            I understand how you believe I am coming off in an abrasive and negative manner. However I have all the replies you sent saved in my e-mail inbox. You deleted a few of them. It seemed like you were more upset over what I wrote than you let off publicly here. Nevertheless, I am peeved off and confused over the new rules that I believe are stricter for no real rhyme or reason.

            • yeah I deleted those comments because they weren’t helpful or productive, apologies for that 🙂
              I entered in intermediate in the last comp and got bumped to advanced just like you 😛

        • “In fact both the scratch-built car before mine AND my own submission itself would both be ineligible from competing this year because of the added rules.”

          Who cares? This is a completely new competition, with a new set of rules. Everyone else seems to be fine with these rules. We are fine with restricting the competition to kits at are widely available, not the obscure kits that you seem to be campaigning for in your comments. Ultimately, if you have a problem with the rules, then don’t join.

          • I care and I have a problem with these rules. That’s why I made these posts. If you don’t care then feel free not to care to yourself and keep it off my post.

            I have problems with not allowing certain kits. The kits I’ve mentioned are not obscure; they just don’t interest you. In fact I’ll put it to you this way…

            Ultimately, if you have a problem with my post, then don’t respond.

    • I am curious what kit or kits or scratch building do you have in mind are affected by the rules they set out so much that made you.
      Its clear to me that these rules they set must have affected your choice or choices of builds greatly for you to look into the rules this much.

      • It sure has. I had several in mind and none of them are available on HLJ. In fact that was my entire strategy. To build and model something no one else has. Something not even similar to what everyone else has.

        I build mecha, and I build planes, and I build tanks, and I have built cars as well. Nobody else here will ever build and post from Games Workshop’s line of model kits like I have. They don’t build from Reaper Miniatures, or from ForgeWorld, or from even the exquisite and beautiful historical and fantastical Pegaso models.

        The idea that I can’t bring forth in full force something like Warhammer Age of Sigmar’s amazing Alarielle The Everqueen, or a Clockwork Dragon from Reaper, is just maddening. We are restricting this to generally eastern/Asian kits. This was not a rule in any of the competitions before this one. When you take into account what HLJ offers, and then you notice what the rest of the world has and the different things available out there, you can help but be disappointed.

        Are you a fan of The Joy of Painting with Bob Ross? Do you like listening to the amazing dulcet tones of an artist while he creates a masterpiece while teaching you how to paint?

        Do yourself a favor and watch this and try not to fall in love.

        Or like I said a Reaper Clockwork Dragon.

        http://www.gardenninja.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/1/files/other-manufacturer/clockwork-dragon.jpg

    • Incredible skill and portfolio aside, I find an issue with impossing restrictions. Restraint and restrictions are part of what makes incredible and inspiring art work. Beethoven composed the ninth symphony, one of the most iconic works of not only music but of art in history. What makes it more amazing? He was virtually tone deaf while composing it. These so called handicaps can be viewed at a very negative light or used for utter greatness.

      So what if HLJ seemingly restricted the entries at “asian” models? There is nothing that prevents you from taking a core “Asian” kit and model around that an obscure model of your choosing. Heck, I’m using used ID cards from my office to spice up my model.

      I’m sure you have all the skill necessary to make a great model despite all these “restrictions”.